Elroy Washington
Interviewed by Leonard Monroe
Present: Sherrie Tucker, Nancy Hiebert, Barbara Hill Jordan,
Virginia Hamm, and Reta Cosby
January 3, 2006
MR. MONROE: Mr. Washington, what is your full name and your date of birth?
MR. WASHINGTON: Elroy Washington.
MR. MONROE: Where were you born?
MR. WASHINGTON: Bloomington, Kansas.
MR. MONROE: What year was that?
MR. WASHINGTON: That was 12/13/15.
MR. MONROE: How long has your family lived in Lawrence, and when did your first family members come to Lawrence?
MR. WASHINGTON: They came to Lawrence in about 1806 I think it was.
SHERRIE: What was their name?
MR. WASHINGTON: Washington.
MR. MONROE: What were your dad and mom's names?
MR. WASHINGTON: My dad's name was Louis Washington. And my mother's name was Belle Washington. Her maiden name was the same as when she got married. She was a Washington before she got married to my father.
MR. MONROE: Did your family have any good storytellers or you remember any stories, your favorite family stories from back in those days?
MR. WASHINGTON: There were so many of them I don't hardly remember any of them (laughter).
MR. MONROE: What parts of Lawrence did you identify with most closely with or where, when you were young? Were there parts of town that you were restricted to go to or what part of town did you live in, or was any part of town that you weren't allowed to go to?
MR. WASHINGTON: I didn't live in town. I lived out in the country mostly.
MR. MONROE: Where in the country?
MR. WASHINGTON: Bloomington.
MR. MONROE: I remember hearing about that place.
MR. WASHINGTON: I was born and raised out there mostly. And my father passed, then we moved to town. Down by where you lived at. Down where Alice lives at now.
MR. MONROE: Wisconsin Street.
MR. WASHINGTON: We lived in the house right south of where she lives at now. We stayed there for about a year, and then we moved back out in the country. Out there by 23rd and Clinton Parkway. And that's where I was from.
MR. MONROE: Yeah, that was the country back then.
SHERRIE: What did you do? What did your family do out in the country?
MR. WASHINGTON: They farmed. And I went to school at Sigel. Sigel School was out there by the spillway. And I had to walk back and forth there every day!
SHERRIE: How far was that?
MR. WASHINGTON: A mile and a half. In the snow, rain...
MR. MONROE: (Laughter). We tell the kids now, "When I was them, I walked to school five miles uphill in snow and five miles down in the snow." But you really did do that?
MR. WASHINGTON: I really did it.
MR. MONROE: In the black community, was you allowed to go anywhere you wanted to, or were there certain parts of town they didn't want you to go to?
MR. WASHINGTON: We always came to town once a week. That was on Saturday afternoon. We could go just about anywhere. But, if we'd go to the movies, we had to go up in the balcony. I remember that part. We could sit just about anywhere we wanted to.
MR. MONROE: Did your family ever take in any boarders, or do you remember anything like that?
MR. MONROE: Where did you attend elementary school? What was the name of that school?
MR. WASHINGTON: Uh, Sigel.
MR. MONROE: How many grades was in that elementary school?
MR. WASHINGTON: Eight grades, one teacher.
MR. MONROE: Was it a segregated school?
MR. WASHINGTON: No.
MR. MONROE: Did it have any athletic programs at all?
MR. WASHINGTON: Nah.
MR. MONROE: Did you ever participate in any sports at any particular school?
MR. WASHINGTON: Nah.
MR. MONROE: Were any of the teachers or coaches African American?
MR. WASHINGTON: Nah.
SHERRIE: Just one teacher for the whole school?
MR. WASHINGTON: Just had one teacher.
SHERRIE: Do you remember the teacher's name?
MR. WASHINGTON: Summers. I never will forget that. She was a nice teacher.
MR. MONROE: Did you have any class officers—elementary, junior high. Were any of them African American?
MR. WASHINGTON: No.
MR. MONROE: Were there any club, organizations, or sports teams that you did in high school?
MR. WASHINGTON: No.
MR. MONROE: Did you interact with any Native Americans in Lawrence while you were growing up?
MR. WASHINGTON: No.
MR. MONROE: What did you feel about your teachers' attitude toward education? Did they offer you support?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yes.
MR. MONROE: All the way through school?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yes, they did.
MR. MONROE: So, there were no problems, as far as the teachers were concerned, going through school?
MR. WASHINGTON: No.
MR. MONROE: Did you graduate from high school?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yes.
MR. MONROE: What did you think of teachers in high school back then?
MR. WASHINGTON: When I went to service, I took some other courses and got my—what do you call that?
MR. MONROE: G.E.D.?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah.
MR. MONROE: When did you join the military? You was in the army?
MR. WASHINGTON: It was November the 7th, 1942.
MR. MONROE: You were in World War II.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah.
MR. MONROE: All right! Go overseas?
MR. WASHINGTON: About seven times.
MR. MONROE: (Laughter).
MR. WASHINGTON: (Laughter).
MR. MONROE: Any combat when you was over there? Or what part of the world were you in during World War II? Was it in Europe or Far East?
MR. WASHINGTON: The Far East. China, Burma, India.
MR. MONROE: Wow! I've heard about those places. Quite a few battles in those places, too. So, after high school, that's when you went into the military?
MR. WASHINGTON: No, I worked on the farm for about seven years before I went there.
MR. MONROE: Oh, I see. After your high school, then you worked on the farm about seven years, and then you went to the army? Were you in the CCC Camp?
MR. WASHINGTON: No.
SHERRIE: Where did you go when you first went into the army?
MR. WASHINGTON: I went to Leavenworth. Got drafted at Leavenworth, then we went to Oakland. I stayed out there six weeks, then we went to Camp Stoma, California. Stayed out there about a year. About a year, and then I went overseas from there. Then we went to China, Burma, India during the war.
MR. MONROE: Do you ever watch the History Channel? I know a lot of those things are on the History Channel. Man, it's really, really fascinating to me.
MR. WASHINGTON: I was out there with the Japanese, and the snakes, and the big old tigers. All that good stuff.
MR. MONROE: Yeah (laughter).
MR. WASHINGTON: Mosquitoes (laughter).
MR. MONROE: (Laughter). They were definitely in those jungles. When you came to St. Luke, what are your first memories of St. Luke?
MR. WASHINGTON: I was a member for about five years now.
MR. MONROE: But was you associated with St. Luke when you were younger?
MR. WASHINGTON: No. No, I was at St. James.
MR. MONROE: St. James was a sister church in North Lawrence.
Were you a Sand Rat?
MR. WASHINGTON: (Laughter). Nah.
MR. MONROE: But you still went to St. James instead of coming over here.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, we went to St. James. I come back to Lawrence in '76. My wife went over there.
MR. MONROE: That woman was quite a cook.
MR. WASHINGTON: She coaxed me to going over there. I wasn't going to church at that particular time. But she coaxed me to start (laughter). Said, "Just go to church." And, so I went. I started going to church.
MR. MONROE: How have you enjoyed St. Luke since you've been coming to St. Luke?
MR. WASHINGTON: Oh, I love it.
SHERRIE: What's your wife's name?
MR. MONROE: It's Cora.
MR. WASHINGTON: Cora. Yes.
MR. MONROE: And, we had dinners. Man, I mean that woman could cook. And she passed, when was that? .
MR. WASHINGTON: 15th of April of 2002.
MR. MONROE: And we really miss her, too.
MR. WASHINGTON: I do too.
MR. MONROE: And what memories of funerals do you have back in the old day? Were they typically segregated? Were they segregated, or you had to have white mortuaries? You remember anything about that? Was it any black mortuaries that you remember?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, there was.
MRS. JORDAN: Bowsers.
MR. WASHINGTON: Bowsers. There was Bowsers, yeah. And there was a Lee.
MRS. JORDAN: Lee got into it later on. They were the same thing, but Lee helped. He moved in later on.
MR. WASHINGTON: Okay.
MRS. JORDAN: Then they had Coopers. It was a white mortuary, but they did black funerals.
MR. WASHINGTON: And there was another named Funks. Remember Funks?
MRS. JORDAN: Oh, yes. T.D. Funk.
MR. WASHINGTON: He was over on Massachusetts Street-- Tenth and Massachusetts wasn't it? On the corner.
MRS. JORDAN: Be in the nine-hundred block.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, Ninth and Massachusetts, on the south side. You remember that?
MR. MONROE: Yep! I sure do now that you've made me think of it.
SHERRIE: How do you spell that?
MR. MONROE: It was F-U-N-K, right?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, that's it.
MR. MONROE: Do you remember any of the black businesses in Lawrence?
MR. WASHINGTON: There was Herbert Lee. He was out there on 23rd and Louisiana. Gleed's Poultry. He had a brother. The brother went to the Air Force. That black Air Force.
MR. MONROE: Tuskegee Airmen.
MR. WASHINGTON: His brother went to that. His name was Glen. And Herbert run the business. Let me see, what else? I can tell you the bar was Blues Bucket (laughter).
MR. MONROE: Yeah, Blues Bucket, it wasn't just a bar. I mean, you could eat and drink. They had some of the best chili you could eat. And they always had that big pot of Navy beans and you had cornbread. We used to go down there and eat lunch some time from junior high school.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah. Green Gable. And the one over in the North Lawrence was run by Coleman. Remember Coleman?
MR. MONROE: Shamrock.
MR. WASHINGTON: Shamrock was run by Coleman. And there's another one I can't recall.
MR. MONROE: Golden Arrow?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, Golden Arrow. That's the one.
MR. MONROE: That was run by
MRS. JORDAN: Hines.
SHERRIE: Did any of those bars ever have music?
MR. WASHINGTON: Oh, yeah.
MR. MONROE: Juke boxes?
MR. WASHINGTON: Juke boxes in those days. What else? There used to be a fur place around here. Bird's Fur Place. Remember that, Bird's Fur Place?
MR. MONROE: No, I don't remember that I don't think.
MR. WASHINGTON: It was over there by the hospital?
MR. MONROE: I know the neighborhood, but I don't know any Bird.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, Bird's.
SHERRIE: Burs, like B-U-R?
MR. WASHINGTON: You spell it just like the birds.
SHERRIE: Like, more like a bird?
MR. WASHINGTON: Bird. Bird's Fur. Let's see. There was Dr. Henry. Remember him?
MR. MONROE: I know it was some doctors.
MRS. JORDAN: He had an office down on Ninth and Vermont.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah.
MRS. JORDAN: On the corner.
MR. WASHINGTON: On the corner.
MR. MONROE: It was Dr. Henry.
MR. WASHINGTON: And there was another doctor. What was his name?
MR. MONROE: Wasn't there a doctor's office in the six hundred block of Kentucky?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, I could see him just as plain, but I just don't remember his name. And we had a lawyer. What was that lawyer that got killed?
MRS. JORDAN: Harris.
MR. WASHINGTON: Harris.
MR. MONROE: Because back then Lawrence did have quite a few black businesses and professional people here.
SHERRIE: You mentioned that you did some work at the poultry place?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, I just brought stuff in there mostly, go out in the country and get chickens and stuff. I'd go out there and bring it to them. And he was a nice guy. [He'd] give us a tip for doing that for him. I didn't work at the place, but I just brought stuff in there to him.
MR. MONROE: Do you consider your faith an important part of your life, your religious faith?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yes, I do.
MR. MONROE: What role has this church played in Lawrence history that you know of? I know you was with us when we up to get on the State Register of Historic Places, and you was with us when we went up to get on the National Historic Register.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah.
MR. MONROE: You remember anything about a Langston Hughes?
MR. WASHINGTON: No, I don't. That's one I sure don't. I was in the service when all that was going on, so I didn't remember all that. A lot of that stuff I don't recall, because I wasn't here. See?
MR. MONROE: When they had these black businesses and doctors and things here, did your family shop at any of the establishments or participate?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah.
MR. MONROE: Any particular ones you might know?
MR. WASHINGTON: We went to a black doctor all the time. The lawyer. The one that left. And, we also, while we were kids, would just go to Blues Bucket a lot (laughter).
MR. MONROE: Blues Bucket was very, very popular.
MR. WASHINGTON: (Laughter). We went down there to eat. Oh, yeah, the Santa Fe. We used to go down to the Santa Fe.
MR. MONROE: It's right over there. The Santa Fe, right down there across from the Santa Fe.
.MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah. Go in there all the time.
MR. MONROE: They had good food too.
MR. WASHINGTON: They had good food, yeah.
MR. MONROE: That's one thing back in those days, looked like all the places had real good food.
MR. WASHINGTON: That's right (laughter).
MR. MONROE: A lot better than it is now as far as I'm concerned.
SHERRIE: What was the food like? What kind of food could you get at these places?
MR. WASHINGTON: Hamburgers and stuff like that.
MR. MONROE: Chili. Navy beans.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah. They had pork chops, if you could afford it (laughter).
MR. MONROE/SHERRIE: (Laughter).
MR. WASHINGTON: Back in those days, money was scarce. My mother used to give me one quarter a week. You had to make that do.
MR. MONROE: That was your allowance?
MR. WASHINGTON: That was allowance. Ten cents for the show, a nickel for the popcorn, and the time was just--whatever you wanted to do with it. Maybe buy candy. That was it.
SHERRIE: So how could you afford to go to all these places with the good food and everything? Did you have to buy food to go there?
MR. WASHINGTON: Oh, yeah. A hamburger wasn't but ten cents. They was real cheap.
MR. MONROE: Yeah, things are a lot different now price-wise than they was then, aren't they?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah. Those days, I was making a little money then. I was making three dollars a week. I was rich those days.
AUDIENCE: (Laughter).
MR. WASHINGTON: Three dollars a week, we were on the ball. You could buy anything you want to those days with three dollars.
MR. MONROE: That's for sure. So you went to a black doctor?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, I went to the doctor.
MR. MONROE: Was you ever hospitalized or any of your family hospitalized, back in those days, at the Lawrence hospital?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yes, I was one time for, for adenoids and tonsils.
MR. MONROE: Was it segregated when you went?
MR. WASHINGTON: No, it didn't seem to be. They just took us in there.
MR. MONROE: Of course, when you sent to the movies, you had to sit upstairs?
In the balcony, what they called Crow's Nest.
SHERRIE: When were you in the hospital?
MR. WASHINGTON: I was a kid then. I was about six or seven. Back in those days, you had to have them taken out to go to school.
MR. MONROE: It seems to be a funny thing, but years and years and years ago, black people could do a lot of things in Lawrence, but then it seemed to change, and they couldn't do anything in Lawrence, and now it's gone back again, where you can do things in Lawrence. But it seemed like for that short period of time, things were just different for a while.
MR. WASHINGTON: See, all them years I wasn't in Lawrence most of the time. I left here in '42, and I didn't get back until '76. So, I don't know about, from '42 up, I don't know what was going on in Lawrence.
SHERRIE: Were you in the service that whole time?
MR. WASHINGTON: I got out in '70, but I stayed in Kansas City for a few years down there.
MR. MONROE: I remembered when you're in Lawrence, there wasn't a lot of eating in none of their restaurants. You was gone most of that time.
MR. WASHINGTON: Well, there was one restaurant we could eat in. That was up there by Seventh and Massachusetts on the east side. I forget the name of it, but it was about middle of the block. We used to go in there and sit down and eat all the time.
MR. MONROE: When was this?
MR. WASHINGTON: That's before I went to the army in the summer in '42. So that would be in the '30s.
MR. MONROE: Was that a black establishment or white establishment?
MR. WASHINGTON: No, it was white. It was a white restaurant.
MR. MONROE: See, that's what I mean about what I said a while ago, seemed like things years and years ago, you could do things, then all of a sudden it seemed like things changed where you couldn't do anything. And now it's back where you can do it again. And I think that was the same way it was in sports at KU. Because years and years ago, they had players and things up there. Then, all of a sudden that just more or less stopped, and now it's back again.
MR. WASHINGTON: But I don't remember the name of that restaurant. But you couldn't go in the front; you had to go in the back and all like that.
MR. MONROE: But you could go in and eat though.
MR. WASHINGTON: We'd go in. We'd go in and eat.
SHERRIE: Where was it? Do you remember?
MR. WASHINGTON: It was middle way of Massachusetts Street, on the east side. But I don't remember the name of it.
MR. MONROE: Do you have any family stories that have been passed down, that you'd like to talk about, or anything about the church or the city you want to talk about at all? That might be sticking in your old memories?
MR. WASHINGTON: Not off hand. I could tell you some stories, but I don't think I'd better (laughter).
MR. MONROE: Well, if you can think of things later on. If you can think of things later on that you thought that you'd wished you would have told us, then you will always have a chance to do that. Now, I notice here that you got this album?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah. I started that. I just started that, but I hadn't finished it.
MR. MONROE: Want to tell us about it?
MR. WASHINGTON: This is me when I was a little boy. I was six months old. And this lady was holding me. I don't remember her name. And I was born right there [copy of a grid of Douglas County in a folder]. That's out there at Bloomington. This is a map of Bloomington.
MR. MONROE: Is this your birth certificate?
MR. WASHINGTON: That's my birth certificate there. And that show the day I was born. My mother had four children, and the father's name there, Louis Washington. Belle Washington. Their birth date.
MR. MONROE: Very good. What else is in there?
MR. WASHINGTON: That's the school I went to.
MR. MONROE: You got that picture. Or a sketch anyway. That's great!
MR. WASHINGTON: And over here is where we used to live at, out there on Clinton. This is this place out there on Twenty-third and Clinton, on the west side of the corner there. That's where it used to be.
MR. MONROE: That was really country back then.
MR. WASHINGTON: That's where it used to be. They done tore it down now. And this picture here is me, before I went to army. And that's Mabel. Mabel Sands. That's her mother.
MR. MONROE: Well, I'll be. I'm going to look at this a little bit closer.
MR. WASHINGTON: Luke Stark was her father.
MR. MONROE: You were lanky. Well, you're still lanky (laughter), but then you were really lanky, wasn't you?
MR. WASHINGTON: (Laughter). Yeah. And the other, that's my step-father, Harry Johnson. That's Evelyn Kimball, and that's Sam Johnson. I don't think you remember him. Right here is a picture of me when I was about six years old. That was taken in Denver, Colorado. That's my mother, my step-father, grandmother. This is the same thing. I don't know who that girl is. That's me, and that's Levi. And that's the army picture.
MR. MONROE: And this is, no doubt, a troop ship leaving Japan December 20th of '48. Left Manila December 21st in '48. Wow! You went over, or coming back under General Patrick. I remember those troop ships.
MR. WASHINGTON: And here's another one here. That's the one that bought me home from the war.
MR. MONROE: General Richardson. Leave India November of '45. Arrive in New York November of '45. But it took about two or three weeks?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, about three weeks.
MR. MONROE: And the old tug boat putting the ship in line. Okay, here are some more interesting pictures. Remember these?
MR. WASHINGTON: That's where we got ready to load the boat to come back to the states. And that's during the war; I was standing there by the tanks. I'd been in the 24th Infantry there.
MR. MONROE: Twenty-fourth Infantry. That was all black infantries, too. Right?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah. That's where I went into, where I took my basic training.
This was during the Korean War.
MR. MONROE: Who's this?
MR. WASHINGTON: I came back from the service and got sharp (laughter).
MR. MONROE/AUDIENCE: Laughter. Very good.
MR. WASHINGTON: That's me again.
MR. MONROE: Very good.
MR. WASHINGTON: That's Sarah. That's one there was during the war. This is Korean War. We were waiting for guard duty. This is Vietnam. And we, we lived in tents over there.
MR. MONROE: (Laughter). This is really, really interesting.
MR. WASHINGTON: I haven't got it finished yet, I was just working on it.
MR. MONROE: Okay. This is a record, Report of Separation. A Honorable Discharge, and that's the one thing they can't take away from you.
MR. WASHINGTON: That's right. I got five of them (laughter).
AUDIENCE: (Laughter).
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, I stayed. I stayed in there 27 years.
SHERRIE: During World War II, were there any USO shows for black soldiers or any USO clubs that black soldiers could go to?
MR. WASHINGTON: I never had no problems. The whole time I was in there, I didn't have no problems at all.
MR. MONROE: But, did they have USO shows where you were at though? Did you get to see any USO shows?
MR. WASHINGTON: Oh, yeah. Yeah, we had some over in the, when we were over in Korea. We was over there some, they came there.
MR. MONROE: You have a chance to see Bob Hope? Or what big entertainers? Do you remember seeing any?
MR. WASHINGTON: Bob Hope, he never would come where we were at.
MR. MONROE: He wasn't going to go where it was too dangerous anyway.
AUDIENCE: (Laughter).
MR. WASHINGTON: He would never come where we was at. We had Hugh O'Brien; he came over where we was at and some lady. I forget that woman's name. She came over where we was at.
MR. MONROE: Not Marilyn Monroe?
MR. WASHINGTON: No. I seen her on TV.
MR. MONROE: Nah, she wouldn't have been... Oh, she would have been to Korea and Vietnam.
MR. WASHINGTON: I forget the woman's name, but she came over where we was at, and, uh, there was quite a few come over there. The big shots come over there. I saw the Beatles. They came over where we was at. And, Perry Mason. He came over and drank with us.
AUDIENCE: (Laughter). Really? (Laughter).
MR. MONROE: (Laughter). Now this was when you was in Korea or Vietnam?
MR. WASHINGTON: I was during Korea. No, Okinawa.
MR. MONROE: Okinawa?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah.
MR. MONROE: When was that?
MR. WASHINGTON: I can't remember the date, but in the '50s. He came over there. He came over. He came over and I seen him over there for about six months. And he came over there with us for a while.
MR. MONROE: Because I was in Okinawa from '51 to '53, but we didn't have no entertainment over there where I was at.
MR. WASHINGTON: Well, we did. Down there at the dock. What's the name of that place down at the dock?
MR. MONROE: Buckner Bay?
MR. WASHINGTON: No, it's Sand.
MR. MONROE: Down at Naha.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah. The Air Force base.
MR. MONROE: Right. I was down there.
MR. WASHINGTON: Is that where you was at?
MR. MONROE: I was at Bishygoa first. Then I was in (inaudible). Then we went through Naha, and I was in the ADCC. Air Defense Control Center down there.
MR. MONROE: Matter of fact, we saw the first jet transport, bouyac, in the third Naha.
MR. WASHINGTON: Is that right?
MR. MONROE: The first jet transport. I mean passenger plane really.
MR. MONROE: But was you at Nam?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, eighteen months of it.
MR. MONROE: Where was you at?
MR. WASHINGTON: Name some of the places. I can't remember the places right now.
MR. MONROE: I remember you were talking about those entertainment, USO show things. I know when I was in Vietnam, entertainers would come over there, but they were in places like Cameron Bay. They always went to the safe places. They never came to the training or no place like that.
MR. WASHINGTON: Cameron Bay are safe waters. See, that's where we landed at. As I remember, up North. I can't remember the place now. Uh, I got some pictures of it, too.
MR. MONROE: Because we landed in Saigon, but then we got on a C130 that took us to our bases.
MR. WASHINGTON: I stayed over there eighteen months.
MR. MONROE: I was only over there fourteen months. That was enough (laughter).
MR. WASHINGTON: I got a break when my sister, Henrietta, passed. And, Grace, Grace Frye. She passed, and I came home for her funeral.
MR. MONROE: I remember her real well. We used to go down there on Christmas. Boy, she could make the best rolls you ever ate in your life.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah. When she passed, I came home for the funeral. I went back, spent six more months over in Vietnam.
MR. MONROE: Anything else you can think about you'd like to talk about? Whether it be the church, the city, or anything?
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, there's something I want to ask you. What kin is you to Grace?
MR. MONROE: Grace Frye was Bob's mother. Bob Frye.
MR. WASHINGTON: Bob Frye.
MR. MONROE: Married my sister, Iris.
MR. WASHINGTON: In other words, my sister had one child. That was Bob?
MR. MONROE: I guess so.
MR. WASHINGTON: I didn't know that.
MR. MONROE: I think that's the way it is.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah.
MR. MONROE: Matter of fact, one of James' daughters is named Gayla Grace, named after Grace Frye.
MR. WASHINGTON: Now, on that, it said my mother had four children, but I don't remember but three. I don't know what happened to the other one. I don't remember. Nobody will ever for me to find about for the fourth.
MR. MONROE: Now, I do remember, a year ago or less, they had your picture in the Journal World. I still got that paper at home, with all you kids lined up there.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah.
MR. MONROE: I kept that. I got that at home.
MR. WASHINGTON: Have you? I have it at home, too.
MR. MONROE: Me and Alice got a kick out of looking at that picture and talking about it. And that's when she was telling me about how you and her used to play out there on old Wisconsin, that old dirt road (laughter).
MR. WASHINGTON: We sure did. Her and Alice and Lavita.
MR. MONROE: Yeah, Lavita.
MR. WASHINGTON: And there used to be some more people live out there name Johnson.
MR. MONROE: Yeah, Mary Johnson.
MR. WASHINGTON: You remember the Johnsons?
MR. MONROE: Yes.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yep, if them girls would come, we'd play with them.
SHERRIE: What would you play?
MR. WASHINGTON: Hide and go seek (laughter).
MR. MONROE: Well, actually Salisbury.
MRS. JORDAN: Oh, Juanita and Pauline.
MR. MONROE: Yeah, Juanita and Pauline.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, you remember those?
MR. MONROE: Yeah.
MRS. JORDAN: Yes.
MR. MONROE: And they lived on Fifth Street. All of us right here lived in this same area, more or less.
MR. WASHINGTON: And Alfred Howard lived up there too.
MR. MONROE: Alfred Howard?
MR. WASHINGTON: Alfred Howard's folks.
MRS. JORDAN: Oh, yeah, they used to live up the street.
MR. MONROE: Yeah, they lived up there in the five-hundred block of Wisconsin. Not Wisconsin, the west corner right up one block over. And the Howards lived across the street, on 6th Street.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah.
MR. MONROE: Amazing when you think of all that stuff. Some of these you never would even think about.
MR. WASHINGTON: That's right.
MR. MONROE: Yeah, we sure remember now that you brought out the names.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah.
MR. MONROE: We all grew up out there together.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, Warren, Alfred, Alice, Vita, and the Johnson kids, girls. We used to have a good time out there playing. My brother Levi was different. He didn't want to play with us. He was stuck up.
MR. MONROE: Yeah, I sure remember Levi. And as a matter of fact, he had to marry Joyce Washington. What was her name before it was Washington?
MRS. JORDAN/MR. WASHINGTON: Harvey.
MR. MONROE: Yeah, Joyce Harvey. I don't know why I asked that question. It was dumb question because I knew that. So she happened to be a Washington too.
MR. WASHINGTON: So, that make my sister have one child. That was Bob. But I don't remember her husband though. You remember her husband?
MR. MONROE: No, I sure don't.
MR. WASHINGTON: And, Henrietta, she had one child. That was Cecil Hultz.
MR. MONROE: Yeah, I remember the name more than anything. Mr. Washington, we sure appreciate getting this information from you.
MR. WASHINGTON: Okay. All right.
MR. MONROE: It's really quite a deal.
RETA: Is this the school on 23rd and Iowa?
MR. MONROE: You call it Iowa now. It more or less was Clinton Parkway, right?
MR. WASHINGTON: It's that school. Where was that school located? Twenty-third and...?
MR. WASHINGTON: What school was that?
MR. MONROE: The one you went to?
SHERRIE: Sigel?
NANCY: I think he said it was Spillway. Out by the Spillway.
MR. WASHINGTON: Oh, the school I went to? Sigel?
SHERRIE: Sigel?
MR. WASHINGTON: It was out there in the country by the spillway. You know where the Clinton Spillway is?
MRS. JORDAN: I knew it would be that far out there.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, it's out there. It was out there, right north of the spillway, about one block. At Clinton Lake.
SHERRIE: Did you draw these maps?
MR. WASHINGTON: I got them at the library.
SHERRIE: How about the sketch of the school? Did you draw that or did you find that?
MR. WASHINGTON: No, that was out there, too. Yeah, all of that was up there.
SHERRIE: They're beautiful.
MR. WASHINGTON: It should be nice when I get it finished. I got a whole lot of stuff I got to put in there.
MR. MONROE: That will be. That will be real, real nice.
MR. WASHINGTON: Something to do. I don't have nothing to do, so I just think of starting something like that.
NANCY: Mr. Washington, in the past, with some of the things like this, they have scanned those. And, as you get more of your pictures together, if it's all right with you, we could scan those and give you copies of those, but also have them so they could be used like that.
MR. MONROE: Put on those black oral history panels. I can take that picture out of the paper I got and put on there too.
MR. WASHINGTON: Okay, I'll do that.
NANCY: But that's only if it's all right with you.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah. It'll be all right.
MR. MONROE: That'll be okay with you, right?
MR. WASHINGTON: All right.
AUDIENCE: (Laughter).
MR. WASHINGTON: Now if you go over to Granddad's, you can find some pictures over there on me. Granddad's over in North Lawrence. Down at the Bowersock by the river. People fishing down there.
MRS. JORDAN: Yeah.
MR. WASHINGTON: And he got a picture of me standing there with my grandfather.
MRS. JORDAN: Oh, my goodness!
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah, he got all that over there.
MR. MONROE: You got all that you going to end up putting in this book? That's going to be quite a book.
MR. WASHINGTON: Yeah.
MR. MONROE: Very, very interesting. That'll be a real part of Lawrence history.
MR. WASHINGTON: I started that about a week ago, and that's as far as I got.
MR. MONROE: (Laughter).
MR. WASHINGTON: During the war and everything, and I'm going to put all that in there.
MR. MONROE: Well, again, we want to really thank you for your time and all this information. That's great. Thank you very much.
MR. WASHINGTON: Thank you for having me.